What skils for my necro?

[Winona]

I been reading the guides for a skelliemancer, and they recommend maxing skellies and masteries. But then they go all bizare and recommend dim vision maxed and CE maxed. I can c the use for both, but i dont think i wanna go that way, insttead im thinking of:

max skellemages
max bonespirit
max bone armour

at least 1 of these have to go, question is which?

helpfull for answers. or other recommendations

[xeyloderixed]

I been reading the guides for a skelliemancer, and they recommend maxing skellies and masteries. But then they go all bizare and recommend dim vision maxed and CE maxed. I can c the use for both, but i dont think i wanna go that way, insttead im thinking of:

max skellemages
max bonespirit
max bone armour

at least 1 of these have to go, question is which?

helpfull for answers. or other recommendations


a lot has been written about this "hybrid" necro build; alas, none is stickied anywhere.

basically, the skill points are similar to what you have in mind. skeletons are of course your main killing weapon (well, at least until hell) with spirit/spear as support (until hell, then they switch places).

spear/spirit is still a hot topic of debate. iirc there is a sticky somewhere at the necro forum discussing both. if you don't want to head over there, here is a summary: spirit and spear have roughly the same damage/mana ratio, but spear pierces. so i think you know what my answer to that question is.

bone armor is soooo 1.09. if you look closely, the synergies to bone armor give more benefit than actual points in bone armor (+5 per point in armor, +10 on synergies). this is good since bone wall, a synergy to bone armor, is also a synergy to spear/spirit.

skellimages do pathetic damage, and have pathetic life, and they dress pathetic, so why use them?

my last attempt at ehcl running was a necromancer. died at lvl 96 by cockiness (aka nOObness). his skill point distribution is as follows:

max raise skeleton
max skeleton mastery
1 in summon resist and all prereqs

1 in decrepify and all prereqs
1 in lower res and all prereqs

max bone spear
max bone wall
rest in bone spirit
and he used the marrowalk bug

i wont post the gear, since you might think i dupe/hack (i dont) or might get scared (too godly?) but if you really want to know i'm sure it's posted elsewhere.

the advantages to this type of build, as opposed to other (note: worse imho) are many, but the most important include:

(1) two types of attack-magical and physical. this helps when you like doing things solo (ie: mf). allows you to mf anywhere and kill anything.
(2) is not lag intensive-less than 15 summons. lets just say the killing power of the 10-odd summons you dont have is magically transfered to a spear. summoning wall is not needed (this creates massive lag to some people, including me)

finally, just to get a feel of how powerful he can be:
dr_xey lvl 96 deceased stats (some of em anyway)

- merc dealt 1k-5k damage
- bone spear reached a high of 2.3k (compare to my pure boner with nosummons and 2.9k)
- has reasonable mf while killing (hc mindset, max res, approx 270 mf)
- 1.1k life, 1k mana

good luck on whatever path you choose.

[Winona]

right, i think ill go max bone spear and max bone spirit then, since they give synergies to each other. i guess both have their uses. Ill drop the skelliemancers since u just confirmed that they suck (i had a hunch about that).

1 point into all curses, 1 point into bonewall (with + skills it will still be usefull).

when im done maxing, skellies + masteries, Bone spear and bone spirit ill put what ever is left into CE (i think the radius they have with only 1 point + skills is OK, so with a few more points into it, it will be just perfect.

second question? 75% block or all vita? So far im using 58 str, 30 dex base energy and rest into vita. Im using homonoculus for a shield.

[tomatoman]

right, i think ill go max bone spear and max bone spirit then, since they give synergies to each other. i guess both have their uses. Ill drop the skelliemancers since u just confirmed that they suck (i had a hunch about that).

1 point into all curses, 1 point into bonewall (with + skills it will still be usefull).

when im done maxing, skellies + masteries, Bone spear and bone spirit ill put what ever is left into CE (i think the radius they have with only 1 point + skills is OK, so with a few more points into it, it will be just perfect.

second question? 75% block or all vita? So far im using 58 str, 30 dex base energy and rest into vita. Im using homonoculus for a shield.
get 75 blocking and WALK dont RUN. that is the most common mistake of alllll d2 players. even if you have 75 block, when u run, it drops to like 25%. so if you walk, you can take like 2x?? 3x?? more hits without dieing as if you run!

[Nexexplo]

I would go with max block (i have it on my skellimancer). If you want max block easy, socket your homonculus with Eld. If you also use Wizardspike and vipermagi you dont have to worry about resists in hell.

[Winona]

I use arm of king leoric, and my homonoclus is socketed with p diamond allready Ill prolly blow it clean for an eld as i hit higher levels and get more res from jewlery.

Im a running man myself. I prefer movement to high block, that imo is only usefull for 2 things, protect me when i cast (standing still) and when game crashes.

Is there a minimum block? a % u get no matter what?

[Syxx]

Hi Winona,

I been reading the guides for a skelliemancer, and they recommend maxing skellies and masteries. But then they go all bizare and recommend dim vision maxed and CE maxed.

I read MongoJerry's adventures about a pacifist necro who went through Diablo, only killing End of Act bosses, and monsters that needed to die in order to complete a quest. All others he bypassed using bone prison, bone wall and DIM VISON. He found DV to be a most underutilized spell by nealy all Necros, so with my latest Necro I decide to try out this spell for myself.

Big problem using DV and skeletons ! I DV'ed some monsters, to limit the number I'd have to fight at one time. This caused them to stand around and not attack, however my moronic skeletons don't understand this, and went off and hit the DV'ed monsters anyway causing them to join in the fight.

I use arm of king leoric,

A now dead Necro of mine used this staff but got killed due the low% chance of casting a Bone Prison on oneself, which this item has as one of its mods. Nothing like imprisoning yourself next to a boss monster and not being able to get away :D

I decided this item even with all the other good mods is simply not worth using due to the self Bone Prison. Its abit like playing Russian roulette... and eventually you'll lose.

Regards
Syxx

[xeyloderixed]

second question? 75% block or all vita? So far im using 58 str, 30 dex base energy and rest into vita. Im using homonoculus for a shield.

this has also been discussed a lot in the necro forum. there is one group that says blocking in unimportant, since you have infinite tanks, you really don't get hit much. there is the other group that says blocking is a bargain: a rough calculation is 100 extra points in dex=200life, but means you get hit only 25% of the time. if a monster hits you five times for 200 points of damage each, you will take 800 damage for 20% (low) block, while only taking (an average) 250 for 75% block. this is of course if the monster actually can hit you 5 times, which is the counterpoint of other group.

i tend to agree with the second group (blocking). but of course what it boils down to is personal preference.

[WaltzingMatilda]

"Nothing like imprisoning yourself next to a boss monster and not being able to get away"

Or when it ends up trapping you in fire. My resists are so bad at the moment that I always end up panicking.

[MGS_BEWD]

a good sekulliemancer build is a full revive necro.
one pt into amp damage
Max skelly mastery
Max skellies
Max Mages
Max summon resist
The last skill is up to you, i would put the pts into revive but its ur choise.

[Pain]

Hi Winona,


Big problem using DV and skeletons ! I DV'ed some monsters, to limit the number I'd have to fight at one time. This caused them to stand around and not attack, however my moronic skeletons don't understand this, and went off and hit the DV'ed monsters anyway causing them to join in the fight.


Syxx

I don't think this is actually a problem. The point behind DV is not to never attack monsters, it's to "park" them until you're ready to deal with them (unless your a pacifist).

Additionally, the biggest use is to prevent ranged attackers from assaulting you or your minions while they deal hand-to-hand damage with other critters.

It also stops monsters from raising (ex: Shamans), then, once they're engaged hand-to-hand, the likelyhood they'll actually raise is greatly reduced (if not negated alltogether).

[STINGER]

Have read this post all week but couldnt respond.

Xey has the build I like personally.

Wether you go spear or spirit is your choice and wether you use Marrow is up to you as even without it the bone spell is still good for solo play and small games getting taht pesky fanta bos killed quicker or helping get the first few skelleis.

I really like to emphasise to NOT max spear and spirit. Both do basically the same thing if you really take a long look at them. Spear shoots naturally faster, and is slightly more than half the damage of spirit but alos pierces and half the mana cost of spirit. The extra with Spear is it pierces and hits more than one thing.

Anyway, make a choice here and stay with it and max your Bonewall. You simply cant replace Bonewall when it comes to the safety of this build. Adding to both Spear and Spirit and also mastery and skellies is going to leave you with a very weak Armor or require you to use Marros to get half the armor you could have.

Block is your choice, personally I dont have max Block I like max life as its big with BO but both ways work just fine. i just wouldnt suggest max block with a poor blocking shield as that leaves you next to no base life.

Personally i say SCREW Dim Vision, my new favorite AI curse is confuse. nothing better than getting all those badies fighting eash other and then watching your merc and minions pound on them and take little to no damage!!!

Confuse also attracts monster off screen a bit making the pack larger for the CE devistation! I tried Dim vision and it left me wanting more. it requires some investment to be very good IMO and I dont want to invest in it while confuse does a multiple things all in one cast.

[Winona]

I am indeed going with the bonespear/wall synergy. I misread the synergies before and thought that wall didnt add to spear. As i rediscovered that it wasent so, wall was a clear choise.

I just soloed NM act 1-3 and then teamed up with a party for act 4-5. I def got the feeling that this is a great build and he is fun to play too :p

It might not be the fastest of killer, but id say he does more then ok.

only have 4 points into spear and 1 into wall and STILL the damage allready helps my cause. I think im going to love this char.

My only problem right now is that i have WAY to few fastkeys.

[xeyloderixed]

My only problem right now is that i have WAY to few fastkeys.

erm? lies

i have 1-8 hotkeyed, and i still need a 9th. and i'm not the best necromancer player ever (because my press-curse-response time is slow O.o)

[xeyloderixed]

Personally i say SCREW Dim Vision, my new favorite AI curse is confuse. nothing better than getting all those badies fighting eash other and then watching your merc and minions pound on them and take little to no damage!!!

Confuse also attracts monster off screen a bit making the pack larger for the CE devistation! I tried Dim vision and it left me wanting more. it requires some investment to be very good IMO and I dont want to invest in it while confuse does a multiple things all in one cast.

sorry for double pose, i dont know how to quote 2 ppl in 1 post :grrr:

anywayz, i'm pretty sure it's the build. on my boner i put 1 in each of the ai, then realized i like dim vision a lot more than the others. now it's at lvl 19 with skills :uhhuh:

i'm pretty sure the people i've rushed/helped appreciate it too. nothing like full gloam/succubus packs paralyzed in 1 hit :lol:

[STINGER]

Well, this isnt necessarily the best way to go but if you arent use to a ton of keys it may help.

i keep spear on my left click.

Skelly F1
Amp F2
CE F3
Decrep F4
Armor F5

Revive F7
Golem F8

F6 i use many things depending on what the situation is. LR, Fire Wall Trangs Set, Confuse, Bone Wall or Prison.

i know many people that play necros a lot can run like 12-16 hot keys but i just try and keep it simple.

[STINGER]

sorry for double pose, i dont know how to quote 2 ppl in 1 post :grrr:

anywayz, i'm pretty sure it's the build. on my boner i put 1 in each of the ai, then realized i like dim vision a lot more than the others. now it's at lvl 19 with skills :uhhuh:

i'm pretty sure the people i've rushed/helped appreciate it too. nothing like full gloam/succubus packs paralyzed in 1 hit :lol:

i like it better when I can get Gloams shooting Oblivs and Death Knights attacking Gloams and a pack 100 Flayers all stabbing each other!!! not only is it entertaining it is productive.

Frozen monsters rocks also so i wont say either is bette I just "enjoy" Confuse!

[xeyloderixed]

Well, this isnt necessarily the best way to go but if you arent use to a ton of keys it may help.

i keep spear on my left click.

Skelly F1
Amp F2
CE F3
Decrep F4
Armor F5

Revive F7
Golem F8



umm i have this setup
1 - amp
2 - switch between lr and decrep
3 - ce
4 - armor
5 - skeleton
6 - open
7 - clay
8 - spear

hmm, as you can see i'm not even close to being skilled to good necros :grrr:

btw, i told you i needed 9, 1 for whatever i'm not using for 2, and one for a random spell that might be useful sometimes (bone wall for example)

i only have 7 fingers!!!!11one!!

[Winona]

well, i found something that works for me. so im happy.

ive started to add to dex and the more i put into it the more i regret it. Whats really dangerous in diablo II? Gloams. Will walking around with 75% block help me then? No, it will just make me an easier target to fry.

Ah well, ill go the distance though. Stupid of me not to think of it and waste all those stat points.

[nater]

my last attempt at ehcl running was a necromancer. died at lvl 96 by cockiness (aka nOObness). his skill point distribution is as follows:

max raise skeleton
max skeleton mastery
1 in summon resist and all prereqs

1 in decrepify and all prereqs
1 in lower res and all prereqs

max bone spear
max bone wall
rest in bone spirit
and he used the marrowalk bug

Kudos to Xey!!! That is almost exactly my hcl build ! The only differences are I chose spirit, and put 1 into revives(plus skills makes it usable) and 1 into fire golem(only time I use him is vs Diablo Clone, normally I use clay). I also agree that max block is king. As for energy...keep it at base, mana pots are cheep. Anything not needed for reqs and max block go to vitality.

Have you guys seen the excuse for a hybrid build they put up on the strategy guide yet? I get the opinion that most the people around are true softies and should never attempt hardcore. True hardcore people REALLY know how to build. We have to, there is no "I killed Baal and only died twice!".

LONG LIVE TRUE HARDCORE!

Lvl 92 necro Knight-Night Useast Hcl

[xeyloderixed]

well, i found something that works for me. so im happy.

ive started to add to dex and the more i put into it the more i regret it. Whats really dangerous in diablo II? Gloams. Will walking around with 75% block help me then? No, it will just make me an easier target to fry.

Ah well, ill go the distance though. Stupid of me not to think of it and waste all those stat points.

the way i see it, you can fix light res easily, but you cant really beat blocking. there are tones of light absorb items out there (tgods, wisp are the most important ones), but where can you get extra block? guardian angel? twitchrow?

trust me, the first time you meet that fanataur guy at the entrace of throne, you'll be glad you put some in block.