Some skills just don't fit

[lumpor]

This is not another rant that the witch doctor should go away, I want some skills to go away. I have nothing against it eplacing the necromancer. I think the necromancer is too stale and un-versatile anyway. But some skills just don't fit the witch doctor. These two are fire bomb and zombie wall. Fire bomb is fire, and is a direct damage spell, which I don't think the witch doctor should have. They should be more strategic and stuff, and fire doesn't really fit him. And as for zombie wall, I do like the idea of an attacking wall, but zombies? A wall of thorny vines that whip enemies close by or something like that would be good, but zombies? They usually don't act as walls y'know. I personally don't want the witch doctor to be able to summon the undead. I've always believed shamans and stuff revive people through rituals (often sacrificing blood), but not the undead. They're tribal, jungle-like religious folk. Not some dark gloomy undead raiser. Even if he should summon the undead, I think a wall of zombies just isn't good. Maybe some kind of pile from which zombie arms reach out to attack the enemies, but not zombies that can't walk

Is there anyone who agrees with me?

[SlechtWeerBeer]

In the trailer, you can see the torso, arms and head of the zombies, and the rest is just molten into the ground. So, they sure can act as a wall ;)
Agreed on the firebomb being out of place, though. They should've given it a more fire-spirit feel, and less Fire Bomb ala Assassin, imo.

[Mad Mantis]

The undead do fit with how you generally see Witch Doctors depicted in popular culture. I like the idea of him being able to raise undead and would love the see more of his undead servants.

The firebomb is a different matter. It feels a bit out of place at the moment. But for me that is mainly because I don't know how that skill tree looks like. If it is an alchemy based skill tree and he has other potions that he can make, it could very well fit in. Right not it looks like they gave one of the Assassins traps to the WD.

[Fizh]

When I first saw the firebomb I thought it was a bit out of place too, but as Mad Mantis said it could be part of a alchemy based line. If there arent any other skills of that type, it could make sense in a different way (atleast in my head :P).. The witch doctor is, as we know, part of a tribe living in the jungle. Imagine the members of the tribe with their masks and feathers dancing around a big fire, worshipping the god of fire. The fire could be the center of their rituals. Just my thoughts :)

[snugglson]

Zombies have a history in voodoo culture, so I think they fit perfectly.

Ive seen a show, probably on the history channel, that talks about the voodoo-zombie connection and they actually believe that it has to do with eating brains and madcow disease. Basically, they mistook the madcow for people being undead.

[OverUsedChewToy]

The only problem I see with the undead-raising is that it (apparently) conflicts with the lore;

" For although the minions of Hell have long possessed this power, among mortals the knowledge to reanimate and control the dead belongs to these priests alone. It is this practice that has lead outsiders to refer to them as Necromancers."

Source: http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/classes/necromancerhistory.shtml

Otherwise I say bring on the zombies :D

[KiLLJOi]

I think they could tie firebombs in if they showed them off as burning, shrunken heads flying through the air or something :wink:

[AxlStrife]

The only problem I see with the undead-raising is that it (apparently) conflicts with the lore;

" For although the minions of Hell have long possessed this power, among mortals the knowledge to reanimate and control the dead belongs to these priests alone. It is this practice that has lead outsiders to refer to them as Necromancers."

Source: http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/classes/necromancerhistory.shtml

Otherwise I say bring on the zombies :D

Both classes hail from roughly the same region, so culture bleeding may have occurred, from a flavor standpoint.

From:http://www.blizzard.com/diablo3/characters/witchdoctor.xml
"Upon further discussions with my hosts, I discovered that these tribes define themselves by their belief in the Mbwiru Eikura, which roughly translates to "The Unformed Land" (this is an imprecise translation, as this concept is completely foreign to our culture and language). This belief holds that the true, sacred reality is veiled behind the physical one we normally experience. Their vitally important public ceremonies are centered upon sacrifices to the life force that flows from their gods, who inhabit the Unformed Land, into this lesser physical realm."
"Alongside the primacy of the belief in the life force and the Unformed Land, the second most sacred belief of the tribes is their philosophy of self-sacrifice and non-individuality, of suppressing one's self-interest for the good of the tribe."

This implies that the natural balance of life and death is maintained above all else, which also fits the necromancer: http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/classes/necromancerhistory.shtml

"Pragmatists in the truest sense, they are above temptation. They see death merely as a natural part of life and do not seek to deny its arrival. Their singular knowledge of the unknown allows them to face death without fear. These ideals, coupled with an understanding of the natural balance between Order and Chaos, explain why they have not fallen prey to the influences of evil.

Their desire to uphold this balance has brought the Necromancers forth from the isolation of their remote, dank homeland to destroy Diablo and his brethren."

[Tsumaru]

If firebomb is essentially an alchemic concoction reminiscent of a molotov cocktail; it works perfectly well for me.

EDIT: Watching the clips on the classes page, it seems it isn't like that. You see a humanoid figure come out of the flames upon explosion. However, this means it still works for me anyway. It's not just like a ball of fire - there is something spiritual behind it, which fits with the whole voodoo/witch doctor thing. Although I'm having trouble figuring out exactly how such a skill works. He clearly throws a ball of fire, but upon eruption you get this fiery spirit. They don't seem to fit together in my mind. Thoughts?

[5zigen]

Seems to fit / make sense to me:

He dispatched his opponent with terrifying precision, assaulting his victim's mind and body with elixirs and powders that evoked fires, explosions, and poisonous spirits.

[Mackan]

I think it will be easier to judge the WD and his skills when we know what the other classes will be, and what kind of skills they will use. Here's hope that Blizzard releases that info soon..

[lukefojut]

The only problem I see with the undead-raising is that it (apparently) conflicts with the lore;

" For although the minions of Hell have long possessed this power, among mortals the knowledge to reanimate and control the dead belongs to these priests alone. It is this practice that has lead outsiders to refer to them as Necromancers."

Source: http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/classes/necromancerhistory.shtml

Otherwise I say bring on the zombies :D

I'd just like to add that while he definitely raises the dead, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of control involved!

As others have said, control of zombies ties in perfectly with a voodoo/witch doctor theme.

[Brother Laz]

The firebomb is a different matter. It feels a bit out of place at the moment. But for me that is mainly because I don't know how that skill tree looks like. If it is an alchemy based skill tree and he has other potions that he can make, it could very well fit in. Right not it looks like they gave one of the Assassins traps to the WD.

The lore says something about magical potions that evoke fire and poison spirits. Look closely at the explosion, there's your fire spirit.

I believe this is the witchdoctor's Bone Spear, a direct damage spell to help out the minions. Imo the Soul Harvest skill is far more out of place, because it seems too much of a mass destruction spam type skill, unlike Bone Spirit.

[SlechtWeerBeer]

More likely the Spirit. Spear just... speared whole legions, so to say ;)
Soul Harvest is like Psn Nova, except direct, rather than over time.

[vendrox]

I think the necromancer is too stale and un-versatile anyway.

That's where I stopped reading ._.

[raveharu]

I'd just like to add that while he definitely raises the dead, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of control involved!


Well I think that's like the basic skill for the witchdoctor, we have yet to see the advanced ones.

Then again, the ability to imbue the summons with the diease thingy skill already shows how the WD are able to modify their summons.


EDIT: the things he summoned are not undead, they are "pets" of somesort. But the wall of zombie is the greatest likely reason why WD will replace the necromancer.

[lumpor]

Oh, I didn't see that the zombies torsos were stuck to the ground. That makes it a bit less out of place.

[Ghoulz]

Witchdoctors make magical potions. It fits to me.

The zombie wall, kinda overdoing it though. If the Necromancer makes a comeback, this skill is just insulting his awsome power.

[Kiley]

Witchdoctors make magical potions. It fits to me.

The zombie wall, kinda overdoing it though. If the Necromancer makes a comeback, this skill is just insulting his awsome power.

That was my response, witch doctors make all kinds of alchemical concoctions, i have no problem with a fire bomb. It makes as much sense of a poison or disease bomb. Unless people are confusing roleplay reasons with game min max reasons, and are just uncomfortable with the new classes being able to do damage types that were the sole venue of previous classes?

Zombie wall I have no opinion on. But I will say I don't want existing character skills preemptively nerfed in expectation of future expansion classes like the beloved necro. That is no way to balance a game, nerfing skills left and right to make them placeholders for a class that may or may not ever even exist in the next 5 years.

Lets just leave it to Blizz to make sure that the necro has amazing skills when and if they release them. Seems silly to call for nerfs to an existing classes skills, just because they step on the toes of a class that might never exist.

[Hodl Pu]

Zombies do fit the witch doctor. Go on google type up "Haiti, Witch Doctor Zombies." (Yes, true occurrences, even though they are not conventional zombies.) Too lazy to tell about what goes on in those articles so just look it up if you're interested. Anything with medicine (concoctions) and manipulation fits witch doctors just fine.

[Ghoulz]

As long as she(cause im not ever gana pick a cripply old black guy) can summon massive mobs like the Necromancer, I'll love it.

But if it's like the Druid, then, pah....

I seen too many old 40-50s zombie-ish movies where some crazed witchdoctor unleashes an army of dead. And some black guy is always wetting his pants.

[Hephaestos]

As for the figure in the flame - I read osmewhere by some artist or designer that the point was to include the image of the Doctor himself in more of his skills. It's supposed to be him you see in the flames for a split second. Much like it's his face in the scare skill.

[Darker Realm]

Zombies are too slow, and disliked in popular culture more than skeletons.

[Mad Mantis]

Zombie speed depends on the movies. I agree that a true Zombie should shamble, but some movies have very fast Zombies indeed.

[Hodl Pu]

Really? Disliked? There is a zombie hype here where I live, so I wouldn't know. Fast or slow, a lot of people I know love zombie movies and books.

[Leugi]

Actually, the WD would have ghouls instead of zombies (so they wouldn't be so slow). As some others said, the fire bomb is mostly alchimical, perfect for our doctor friend. He'll probably be a master of alchemy and herbs, after all he uses herbs to get in spiritual trance.

[NKlint]

after all he uses herbs to get in spiritual trance.

:scratchchin: Just who does he get these "Herbs" from? :wink:

Necromancer or no Necromancer, I steel be tryin' 'eem mon!

[Ghoulz]

Actually, the WD would have ghouls instead of zombies (so they wouldn't be so slow). As some others said, the fire bomb is mostly alchimical, perfect for our doctor friend. He'll probably be a master of alchemy and herbs, after all he uses herbs to get in spiritual trance.

Ghouls are demons, they really don't belong in the undead category. They don't fit in with a witchdoctor, cause they really aren't evil, even though they seem so.

I see the Witchdoctor commanding spirits. Maybe a malevolent spirit as some sort of summon.