Charge/WW Barb?

[HappyAssassin]

I know it's very early and balance issues will probably change a lot of things, but as anyone else noticed that the Barbarian in D3 has charge AND whirlwind? Given the low chance of an "Enigma" style item granting teleport to the masses, what are duels against that going to look like? I know that watching the witch doctor amble around the jungle I was thinking he'd be incredibly easy prey for the barb. The mobility of charge and leap combined with the mobility and damage of whirlwind seems like it's going to be pretty tough to beat in a no-teleport environment. :scratchchin:

I guess we'll have to wait and hope there are some other awesome combos/mobility skills/attacks that can counter it.

Also, hi to Mike and anyone else from D2 who might happen to read this. I missed you guys. I'm excited for D3, I'll definitely be playing it, but no I'm not coming back to D2. I don't have the game any more, nor an account to use for duels. Since the odds of an Assassin seem low, I'm looking at a female charge/ww baba to take the place of my old friend Runics (course if there is a finesse melee class, I'll be playing that). I hope those claw style weapons in the artwork find their way into the game! Can't wait to PK some fools.

[Uncle_Mike]

Also, hi to Mike and anyone else from D2 who might happen to read this. I missed you guys.

Hi indeed :) Welcome back :)

I do hope more d2 people start posting here but I guess we need more pvp related info first or just more info in general, it's pure speculation so far. Barb's skills do look promissing.

It will be a lot more interesting once the 3 remaining classes are revealed.

[Anathema]

The baba had a great deal of mobility in the first place. Assuming Blizzard keeps PvP in the game, they more than likely will not assign it any great significance to it during skill balancing.

As I said though, he was fast in the first place with a few points in his increased speed skill. sometimes too fast for decrepify to take care of- but I always found a way :)

All in all the baba was the easiest class for my necros to kill. I expect more of the same- using the witch doctor of course.

As far as enigma.. I quit long before that garbage ever came out.

Leap doesn't really grant much mobility in my experience. One should never stop moving, and leap will probably miss a mobile PC, discounting bad luck or good timing.

[Queen Mebd]

Also, hi to Mike and anyone else from D2 who might happen to read this.

:wave:

It'll sure be interesting to see how charge works on the new bnet (if it's possible to desynch just by charging around). Perhaps a strong locust swarm that does solid damage over time could counter a barb running around with charge and not pressing with whirlwinds, maybe zombie walls could soak up ww hitchecks while dealing some damage too. We'll just have to wait and see. :jig:

[jakotaco]

*zig-zags behind a couple of zombiewalls ready to dodge the incoming leap*

There will probably be ways to avoid that charge/WW combo. But I must agree it sounds quite lethal... heck a barbarian could probably charge through a zombiewall without taking too much damage to be out of the game.

[Q33]

As Anathema pointed out, in D2, one way to counter a barb (assuming they werent a pure speeder), was decrepify. Maybe witchdoctor or one of the other classes will have a similar spell to slow them down...even during their charge strike? So after being decrepified, they would only be able to move at normal speeds. They would still be able to leap around quickly, but like Anathema said, that ever hardly actually hit someone. It'd have to be a leap/WW combo or something.

Man, this is all too similar to how to fight in Diablo 2. I hope they come up with some really different skills that cause a big change in the way people fight :)

[HappyAssassin]

Me too, though in considering my favorite play style in D2 (ghost assassin), the idea of a charge/stun stomp/ww barb seemed quite similar. With any luck, it'll be as hard to use as a ghost is in the last game, which should keep large numbers of people from doing it.

I for one am REALLY looking forward to the possibility of 1.09 D2 and earlier type duels, with more strategy and running and less *blink *blink *blink *cast flashiness. I do hope and pray that we don't see the return of the "only bowazons and sorceresses" game balance though.

-edit by the way, I am theory crafting, which is my god-given-right since the game hasn't come out yet! Enjoying it while it lasts...

[yelopen]

Hey, what's up! I just came back too :P

I think there will be a class that sort of incorporates the assassin because on Blizzard's D3 Webpage it says you can "lay cunning traps", or something of that sort. But it probably won't have Whirlwind =/

I noticed Charge on the Barb too...seems interesting. Although it won't happen, if charge could desynch in D3 that would be pretty deadly.

[phool]

WB HappyAssassin, I too came back when I heard D3 was on its way.

Charge + ww does seem borderline unstoppable put in the context of a pre-eni D2 and I'd think it'll be a viable pvp option in D3 (would clagging be likely to exist in D3, anyone?). But with the possibility of key game mechanics like fhr being dealt with very differently, I'm not going to be making any guesses yet.


I think there will be a class that sort of incorporates the assassin because on Blizzard's D3 Webpage it says you can "lay cunning traps", or something of that sort. But it probably won't have Whirlwind =/

"Rain Hell on your enemies wielding the interactive environment as a weapon: lay cunning traps, turn destructible objects against your foes, and use environmental obstacles to your advantage - all powered by the Havoc physics system."

Emphasis mine. To me it's pretty clear traps refers to utilising the mutable environment in this context. My guess is D2-like traps will be included, but I see them most likely integrated into a primarily ranged class.

[Arbedark]

I know it's very early and balance issues will probably change a lot of things, but as anyone else noticed that the Barbarian in D3 has charge AND whirlwind? Given the low chance of an "Enigma" style item granting teleport to the masses, what are duels against that going to look like? I know that watching the witch doctor amble around the jungle I was thinking he'd be incredibly easy prey for the barb. The mobility of charge and leap combined with the mobility and damage of whirlwind seems like it's going to be pretty tough to beat in a no-teleport environment. :scratchchin:

I guess we'll have to wait and hope there are some other awesome combos/mobility skills/attacks that can counter it.

Also, hi to Mike and anyone else from D2 who might happen to read this. I missed you guys. I'm excited for D3, I'll definitely be playing it, but no I'm not coming back to D2. I don't have the game any more, nor an account to use for duels. Since the odds of an Assassin seem low, I'm looking at a female charge/ww baba to take the place of my old friend Runics (course if there is a finesse melee class, I'll be playing that). I hope those claw style weapons in the artwork find their way into the game! Can't wait to PK some fools.

Have FAITH!

[Siniz]

What about the witch doctors "horrify" (just guessing the name here) spell? It'd make the barb run around for a while, letting the doctor to gain some distance and cast some spells on the barbarian.

[Fists of War]

What about the witch doctors "horrify" (just guessing the name here) spell? It'd make the barb run around for a while, letting the doctor to gain some distance and cast some spells on the barbarian.

Based on DII I'm 90% sure DIII will not have any "fear" or "stun" attacks that will be able to completely take control away from the player. But then again, PvP may take a new direction and include things like this, but IMO it'd be detrimental.

[nicro tower]

Fear should act like an interrupt for the first few times you cast it, *** I find it hard to believe one can just shake off their worst nightmares without flinching... but after awhile one would be able to know it's just a trick.

And I said interrupt because, as Fists of War said, loss of control would be detrimental to the Diablo style of PvP.

Oh I mean interrupt like in getting Mind Blasted, or Leaped.

[phool]

Based on DII I'm 90% sure DIII will not have any "fear" or "stun" attacks that will be able to completely take control away from the player. But then again, PvP may take a new direction and include things like this, but IMO it'd be detrimental.

Yeah, stunlock at the click of a button beyond what D2 has is definitely not going to happen in a solo-centric game, it would lead to extremely degenerate gameplay.

[yelopen]

WB HappyAssassin, I too came back when I heard D3 was on its way.

Charge + ww does seem borderline unstoppable put in the context of a pre-eni D2 and I'd think it'll be a viable pvp option in D3 (would clagging be likely to exist in D3, anyone?). But with the possibility of key game mechanics like fhr being dealt with very differently, I'm not going to be making any guesses yet.





Emphasis mine. To me it's pretty clear traps refers to utilising the mutable environment in this context. My guess is D2-like traps will be included, but I see them most likely integrated into a primarily ranged class.

You don't exactly lay the environmental traps though do you? It seems as if the traps are already there and you just activate them or whatever.

Edit: Ollie I just read your goodbye thread, since I wasn't around then. Thanks for mentioning me :D I thought you said barbs were boring haha.

[HappyAssassin]

We'll have to wait and see on the traps. It seems likely to me that the assassin and amazon will be combined in some form or another (they were both classes with melee and ranged components supplemented by a passive/buffs skill tree after all) and such a class is the most likely to have traps if they're in the game in the D2 sense. My guess is the D2 style trap that appears from thin-air and fires independently will not make a reappearance. The fact that they were basically spammable offensive weapons was pretty silly when you think about it. "Sentry Guns" would have been a better description. If traps come back I hope blizzard will make them short ranged and extremely deadly, so they reward actual tactics and trapping that cause the enemy to come into contact with them.

I'm just a little concerned for the sake of PvP when I see that the barb has:
1) A very fast movement skill that may or may not desync.
2) A mobile attack (whirlwind) that may or may not desync and will presumably have the same benefits as whirlwind in D2 (clipping, triwhirls, decent range)
3) A stunning attack (war stomp or w/e they called it).
4) An escape skill (leap) that also helps them bypass barriers.
5) An AoE melee skill that could help him cope with summons (the main weakness of whirlwind).

I know that the damage/duration/mana costs will probably change a lot, but making the pretty reasonable assumption that they will approximate their D2 equivalents in behavior, this seems like a really nasty package for hunting other characters. We all know how effective the BvC could be in D2, and the main threats to that class were characters that won't exist unless there's an "enigma"; teleporting, high block, non-elemental casters. The value of charge is greatly magnified without universal teleport. I'm just concerned that we'll have to go through a bunch of patches before we get reasonable PvP. D2 had some patches where PvP was a total bust, and since it's my main interest in D3 I'm a little disheartened to see early signs of poor balance.

[mephiztophelez]

heya Ollie!!!!!


I'm just a little concerned for the sake of PvP when I see that the barb has:
i rekon it's a little early to be overly worried mate. we have no idea what the bulk of the skills will be yet.