View Full Version : This game needs a 30 second log out timer
Let's face it. You can't taker HC players seriously when they can instantly leave the game and all danger at the push of a button. Alot of people emphasize the brutal reality of hardcore play. That you can die only once. Like in reality. But let's face it. In reality you can't escape danger faster than Neo at a phonebooth.
I bellive the only way the hardcore community will be able to take itself seriously is if the game has a 30 second log out timer. So if you get yourself into a very dangerous situation then you better damn well get yourself out of it. Like in real life. That is what HC should be about. Currently hardcore is not about survival of the fittest but rather survival of the hermit who is quickest on the escape key.
Jack Carael
29-10-2008, 19:32
Hm.. I've never played Hardcore, only been online for a few months, but this seems like a good idea.
Problems I see arising: Muling, leaving for fear of PK, slower MF runs (not that much of a problem), relogging to get your corpse back from a sticky place.. Just naming a few, there are tonnes more.
Nimbostratus
29-10-2008, 22:29
Jack Careal: Most of those problems are things that won't be in D3 the same way they were in D2. PKing is gone, drops should be balanced away from boss runs, etc.
However, what exactly are people supposed to do when something IRL calls them away when they're in the middle of something? "Too bad, your char is dead now" seems incredibly jerkish for something they have no control of as a player.
However, what exactly are people supposed to do when something IRL calls them away when they're in the middle of something? "Too bad, your char is dead now" seems incredibly jerkish for something they have no control of as a player.
They die! That's HC. No room for weaklings with social lives.
Lagspike? DIE
Power failure? DIE
Windows crash? DIE
The ladder will be filled with the meanest badest level 40 mother****ers that battlenet ever saw. Pure, evolutionary, military grade, alpha males.
MoUsE_WiZ
29-10-2008, 22:41
http://forums.diii.net/showthread.php?t=669152
Long thread is long. Also, 30 seconds is way too long. Diablo is an action franchise, sitting around for 30 seconds to log out is boring.
30 seconds. That how safe you need to be to log out. You hit log out and 30 seconds later you dissapear. Nevermind combat status. The imporant thing is that people should not be able to get out of danger in an instant. It ruins hardcore.
jamesisbest
30-10-2008, 00:53
10-15 seconds should work with the same effect but I would like the idea of no instant log out. Saving and quitting definately is a get out of jail free card in Diablo 2. Of course some people weren't content with that and took it a step farther with chicken hack so that they were nearly impossible to kill.
Gigashadow
31-10-2008, 00:22
The ladder will be filled with the meanest badest level 40 mother****ers that battlenet ever saw. Pure, evolutionary, military grade, alpha males.The opposite of what I want to see... in fact, I'd rather those people didn't even exist in and out of video games... not that it would happen with a 30-min log out timer.
Ahem.
It's sort of hard to say what can be implemented considering the muddy info on town portal mechanics and what not... but I don't like log out timers because they interfere with the game speed.
I think what would help is having a freezing leave. You want to leave, for a brief period of time (like 3 seconds) your char can't do anything and he can be attacked by whatever monsters he's avoiding, maybe even with temporarily lowered health or something. So, as long as you find a safe spot, you can leave. If you are surrounded, you can't.
Artimedes
02-11-2008, 19:16
They die! That's HC. No room for weaklings with social lives.
Lagspike? DIE
Power failure? DIE
Windows crash? DIE
The ladder will be filled with the meanest badest level 40 mother****ers that battlenet ever saw. Pure, evolutionary, military grade, alpha males.
Sounds more like the ladder will be filled with whoever has the best connection and least amount of friends. If i have to go now I have to go now, i dont want to be penalized with death just because something in real life calls or because comcast decided to screw with my connection. I want to die because I screwed up, not because I get a blue screen, and I want the hardcore ladders to be filled with the best players, not the ones with most stable connections. Chicken exists should be, and im sure will be, dealt with, but a 30 second timer is too much.
Sounds more like the ladder will be filled with whoever has the best connection and least amount of friends.
And that's different than how it is now how? In any game?
The problem with having instant logout or instanttp, as pointed out many times in the thread Mouse_Wiz referenced, it's the only way to prevent chickenhack with any degree of certainty.
If you cant wait 10 seconds to do whatever else is demanding your attention either it's too extenuating a circumstance to seriously matter, or you're playing when you really shouldn't be.
Either way, the HC game shouldn't be dumbed down(read: save and exit = best skill in the game) just because people complain that they cant wait 10 seconds to exit the game.
Gigashadow
02-11-2008, 21:51
it's the only way to prevent chickenhack with any degree of certainty. So much for thinking outside the box... it's certainly not the only way...
Some Hot Sauce
03-11-2008, 04:55
It makes more sense to limit players from leaving unless they are in town. If you need to do something in real life then tp out and log.
Artimedes
03-11-2008, 07:09
And that's different than how it is now how? In any game?
Well I dont know about you but Ive seen a ton of people who do nothing but play and are still horrible at games, and Ive seen people who get on a few times a week and dominate. This is why i love hardcore, it helps weed out the crappy players. Just because you play a crapload doesnt mean you wont do something stupid or wreckless and lose your character, and the smart players are the ones who last the longest (thats how it used to be at least). Why should a good player lose his character just because he doesnt have the time to find a spot where hell be safe for the next 30 seconds, even if he isnt close to dieing at the time? Id be willing to bet the timer (if they use one) ends up being ~5 seconds, which is a lot longer than it seems when you're getting your *** handed to you. I like the idea of town only exits best so far though.
MoUsE_WiZ
03-11-2008, 07:32
*sigh*
It'd be nice if people actually "read" the thread I linked so they wouldn't keep rehashing the same things...I didn't put it there for the fun of it.
Instant exit in town was what (I believe) I first suggested before WWI.
However, portals are, to the best of anyone's knowledge, out of the game. Blizzard does not want people to be able to return to town quickly. Waypoints seem to be one way only. Portals do not exist.
Therefore making people log out in town would likely end up taking more time than a timer. By a lot.
Jack Carael
03-11-2008, 17:59
Apart from what mouse_wiz said, imagine running out of TPs..?
Gigashadow
03-11-2008, 21:08
Apart from what mouse_wiz said, imagine running out of TPs..?Your fault? lol
Sylvanite
04-11-2008, 03:22
I like the idea of a character freeze for 3 or 4 seconds. Maybe armor reduced to zero during that time. This way you can avoid chickenhax and people saving and exiting due to danger, plus you don't have to wait 30 seconds. I think it was Giga that said it originally.
Gigashadow
04-11-2008, 03:43
I think it was Giga that said it originally.Yes, thank you very much for reading.
MoUsE_WiZ
04-11-2008, 07:49
A character freeze for a few seconds isn't seperate from a log out timer (5-7 was what was being suggested in the other thread iirc). You can still choose to skip it and have your character sit in the game without you watching while it counts down serverside. WoW has that built in, but even if it didn't there's nothing to stop you from alt+f4 or ctrl+alt+del or whatever. As such there's no real reason to have a freeze without also having a timer you can sit and watch and maybe cancel.
The armour/hp/whatever defensive stat reduction is an interesting addition to it, as it allows for a shorter timer with the same danger, but here's the other thing with S&E in D3.
From everything we've been told D3 will be based on attrition rather than 1 hit kills.
This means that the thing killing you is more likely to be cumulative damage over multiple packs of monsters rather than an "OH ****! S&E NOW!" moment.
As such, any S&E outside of town, that allows you to return to town and heal, is going to be abused. If all you have to do is retreat a screen or two to get the monsters to stop following you before exiting (regardless of duration of timer) nobody's going to die. Ever.
The solution to this I'm kind of toying with in my head is;
-when you S&E you end up in approximately the same place you you exited from from the old map (with no monsters for x yards probably)
-monsters respawn behind you, not on a hard timer (as in WoW) but on a triggered timer that starts when you enter (or spend 10+ seconds in, incase you're looking for one area and find another) the next zone, but after that they respawn fairly quickly... would need to flesh this out better for if there are multiple people in the same basic area but not working together, but something along those lines
-instead of having players "waypoint" to parties from town, they can be summoned from the wilderness, this way you won't necessarily be stuck out in the middle of nowhere next game when you want to play in a party, but I'm thinking asking for a summon from random people while at low health would be pretty dangerous too so it's not a get out of jail free card either, especially if you have no friends on at the moment
-theoretically there'll be a quick way back to town at the end of any trek anyways... as much as Blizzard doesn't seem to want quick town trips, I don't imagine they want people walking backwards from Durry to get to Lut Gohlein either, so if you're playing properly having respawns behind you won't matter
Something along those lines is what I'd like to see.
However I suspect what we'll end up with is a timer as it just seems easier to implement in the first place with less concern for balance.
Apocalypse
04-11-2008, 16:02
I like this idea, I like it a lot actually. All the so called problems jack has mentioned are not actually problems at all. No more pk, who cares if the mf run is slowed by 30 seconds, muleing I pray is a thing of the past, run out of tp? Too damn bad. Do we even have tp anymore? Also I thought I heard you no longer have to get your corpse?
I think the timer should only take effect outside of town, if you are in town you can leave instantly. I think this should expand to the townportals also(again are they in or out?). make the townportals only castable if you have been out of combat for more than 30 seconds. This would prevent the instant tp to get the hell outa dodge but still give us a free ride to town when we want one
Gigashadow
04-11-2008, 17:34
Yeah, I think that works a lot better. It would also work as a progress-saving thing.
teh_Thrasher
06-11-2008, 05:57
10 second logout would be fine. kind of like the screen slowly dims away. and ur character is still able to be attacked. would prevent hardcore players from abusing S&E.
30 is WAY too long. it would def mess with the games fun levels.
teh_Thrasher
06-11-2008, 06:00
10 second logout would be fine. kind of like the screen slowly dims away. and ur character is still able to be attacked. would prevent hardcore players from abusing S&E.
30 is WAY too long. it would def mess with the games fun levels.
Apocalypse
06-11-2008, 16:14
30 second is not really that long, besides if you are in town it would be instant. 10 second would also work though with the pace D3 will be (i assume). 20 second would probably be the best......
Nimbostratus
06-11-2008, 21:15
30 second is not really that long
"Failed To Join"
I'm sure that's on the screen well under 30 seconds, but it is incredibly frustrating.
The way it reads, there's no Akara to run to when you need a full life bulb. Leaving instantly won't save you; your character flies back to his last quest point or whatever, leaving you to trudge back through the monsters that almost killed you before.
Honestly a 2 second timer with forced inactivity for those 2 seconds would prevent using s+e like it was often used in D2, where if you're not going to die pretty much instantly you're not at risk at all unless you're surrounded by weak enemies which would kill you on death liked bugged FE mummies or enemies invulnerable to all your attacks and you have no mobility skills. While in D3 the damage seems set to tend towards attrition, an increase in mobility skills also seems likely and would counter this. As far as I know, like D2, when not physically trapped, if you need to get away you can always simply run away faster than your enemies who won't be able to hit you as you get out of range faster than they attack. A system like this does seem like it's pretty much the only way Blizz could prevent chickenhack, though my ignorance of the technical details prevents me ruling out a system that reports life in some revolutionary way.
30 seconds is decades when playing a game. I wouldn't play a game with a 30 second area loading time unless you switch areas very rarely. Being able to switch games frequently is integral to many elements of D2 MP.
The way it reads, there's no Akara to run to when you need a full life bulb. Leaving instantly won't save you; your character flies back to his last quest point or whatever, leaving you to trudge back through the monsters that almost killed you before.
Blizz aren't going to kill pace by forcing players to wait around when they finish battles/start games on low health. Apparently they've boosted passive health regen considerably as seen in the barb promo vid.
Artimedes
11-11-2008, 05:50
Apart from what mouse_wiz said, imagine running out of TPs..?
I though they were gonna have a permanent tp system this time around?
they die! That's hc. No room for weaklings with social lives.
Lagspike? Die
power failure? Die
windows crash? Die
the ladder will be filled with the meanest badest level 40 mother****ers that battlenet ever saw. Pure, evolutionary, military grade, alpha males.
amen to that!
well you have to try and put it in a D3 sense as it is. There wont be PK, there wont be Chicken hacks, there wont be hacks that let you leave etc.
Good idea, I know 100% i've used the quick escape probably 100 times. Never chicken hack ever, but the quick leave I have and my chars lived because of it. 30 seconds is too much IMO I like the 10-15 though.
Also, Muling could be totally out of game in d3 ;)
Edit: 30 seconds can feel like an eternity! Especially if you are staring at a clock counting down, and have one foot out the door cause your late and have to leave and just want to make sure you dont come back to a dead char
MoUsE_WiZ
11-11-2008, 22:03
well you have to try and put it in a D3 sense as it is. There wont be PK, there wont be Chicken hacks, there wont be hacks that let you leave etc.
If there's no timer or other deterrent to leaving, there will be chicken. It's not something that's really practical (or, depending on implementation, possible) to catch. Blizzard knows this. Pickit is another thing that isn't practical for them to catch, at Blizzcon they stated one of the reasons they've now got individual drops was to prevent pickit, chicken is likely to receive the same treatment.
There's no PK, but there's going to be some form of PvP. If you listed "no pk" because people don't need to leave to avoid PKs, then fair enough. The concern, though, is about people leaving in whatever form of PvP makes the game to avoid death when they're losing.
That_Other_Guy
13-11-2008, 01:15
Chicken will receive the same treatment if they care enough.
I'm of the "logout timers detract from fun" camp. If TPs are in and "abusing" them is so terrible, maybe make them take 3-5 seconds to materialize wherever you pointed?
If there is a logout timer, 30 seconds is way too long, even if it only applies in hardcore and only happens outside of town. If you were going to die and needed to exit to stop it, 5-10 seconds would kill you just as readily as 30.
teh_Thrasher
13-11-2008, 01:46
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny
they die! That's hc. No room for weaklings with social lives.
Lagspike? Die
power failure? Die
windows crash? Die
the ladder will be filled with the meanest badest level 40 mother****ers that battlenet ever saw. Pure, evolutionary, military grade, alpha males.
lol thats funny. and i agree. i want to see a more competitive ladder and not just chickens that save and exit when they are in danger. there needs to be a timer to prevent this. (2 seconds wont do it because as blizzard has stated this game will not be full of monsters that can kill in 1 hit, ull probably be more apt to die to large mobs) 10-15 seconds would be prime.
I'd prefer something more like 2-5 secs of COMPLETE defenceless standing, with low def, increased dmg received, and such, so you have to find a nice spot for exit. I myself used S&E much when I played HC, and even if it was funnier than to die alone and start all over again, it's a bad loophole in HC.
and the alt+f4 mentioned earlier, it isn't good in HC. I've died of using it, because bnet servers don't understand that you left before ~5 secs later. and within that time you just sit and take dmg.
MoUsE_WiZ
14-11-2008, 03:35
and the alt+f4 mentioned earlier, it isn't good in HC. I've died of using it, because bnet servers don't understand that you left before ~5 secs later. and within that time you just sit and take dmg.
If you're talking about my mention of alt+f4, you should reread the context I mentioned it in. It was not mentioned to point out you can bypass a timer via alt+f4 (because you're right, generally you can't), it was mentioned to point out that if your character is left in game while a timer ticks down, even if it's labeled a "freeze" instead of a "timer", it's still for all intents and purposes a timer, and you don't need to sit and watch it count down as it will continue to do so even if you alt+f4.
If you're talking about my mention of alt+f4, you should reread the context I mentioned it in. It was not mentioned to point out you can bypass a timer via alt+f4 (because you're right, generally you can't), it was mentioned to point out that if your character is left in game while a timer ticks down, even if it's labeled a "freeze" instead of a "timer", it's still for all intents and purposes a timer, and you don't need to sit and watch it count down as it will continue to do so even if you alt+f4.
sorry, my bad then :p didn't read it carefully, but understand what you mean after I read it through couple of more times.
Also, Muling could be totally out of game in d3 ;)
Impossible without preventing trading altogether. They could make it unecessary though. No idea whether D3 will have the same system for what happens to equipped items on death in HC as D2, probably not imo.
GoBigRed
17-11-2008, 19:32
I hope they go with a serverside countdown based upon how many hits it's gonna take, if it's 1-5 hits, I could go with 5 seconds, if it's 10+, it definetly needs to be more like 30 seconds unless monsters are gonna move much faster than they did in the previous games, either way, it needs to be an actual hardcore mode than just some casual player who wants the ultimate scare to be a unexpected tap on the shoulder
Nimbostratus
17-11-2008, 22:23
I hope they go with a serverside countdown based upon how many hits it's gonna take, if it's 1-5 hits, I could go with 5 seconds, if it's 10+, it definetly needs to be more like 30 seconds unless monsters are gonna move much faster than they did in the previous games, either way, it needs to be an actual hardcore mode than just some casual player who wants the ultimate scare to be a unexpected tap on the shoulder
The point isn't to guarantee that the player dies if he has to leave the computer. It's to prevent cheapness in escaping a certain-death situation.
GoBigRed
18-11-2008, 17:51
The point isn't to guarantee that the player dies if he has to leave the computer. It's to prevent cheapness in escaping a certain-death situation.
You might've misunderstood me there or I may have explained my view poorly, whichever, here's a little more explanation on what I was thinking. I was saying that if there are alot of 1 hit kills in it still, then a smaller timer should be assumed, but if you have to be hit 20 times to die, they should have a longer timer because the timer is kinda pointless still if you know that you aren't gonna die anyways. Most decent players especially as time goes on, will recognize when they are in a bad spot and will just leave right away at full health rather than risk the timer later.
teh_Thrasher
18-11-2008, 23:46
a slow phase out process, all of your armor disappears (including blocking) 5 seconds, and ur out of game. voila.
a lot of ppl are impatient and 10-15 seconds is an eternity when ur game hopping.
ICheatAtGolf
11-12-2008, 00:33
I think a timer should be added, but the timer should NOT be interrupted by combat status. I think Johnny may have said this.
This way, you wouldn't be able to escape from danger instantly, but you'd still be able to escape from danger, which is essential with the removal of the TP.
Also, this logout timer should not occur if you are logging out while standing in town or any other safe area.
Funkopotamus
11-12-2008, 02:36
The way this sounds like it'll work out for me is - there's no longer the risk of monsters 1 shotting you? Then there's no longer a risk of me dying because I start lagging for a few seconds, thus there's no longer the need to use save and exit as an ejection seat. Therefore the log out timer only serves to annoy me when I want to leave or join the wrong game... and want to leave.
MoUsE_WiZ
11-12-2008, 06:28
The way this sounds like it'll work out for me is - there's no longer the risk of monsters 1 shotting you?
It does sound like that, but it also sounds like you'll be forced to either not play or to play at lowish life totals, so although nothing is going to 1shot you from full it sounds like there will be a risk of getting ambushed by something scary while you're running around at 10-20% trying to get a healthglobe to drop and getting owned pretty quick.
Of course it's tough to speculate on this front when they don't even have Act 1 finished from the sound of it =)
serves to annoy me when I want to leave
Consider that Blizzard is likely looking to cut down on the number of 30 second MF runs, and they don't necessarily want people getting easy heals by leaving the game, joining it again, then immediately porting to where their friends are because that would be tedious... wouldn't surprise me to see logout timers in the game strictly to serve as that sort of annoyance to try and keep people in games regardless of balance issues with HC.
Funkopotamus
11-12-2008, 15:43
It does sound like that, but it also sounds like you'll be forced to either not play or to play at lowish life totals, so although nothing is going to 1shot you from full it sounds like there will be a risk of getting ambushed by something scary while you're running around at 10-20% trying to get a healthglobe to drop and getting owned pretty quick.
Of course it's tough to speculate on this front when they don't even have Act 1 finished from the sound of it =)
I tend to be a pretty careful player so chances are I'll be playing some kind of tank character or be using a kiting strategy.
If this speculation is true though, it sounds like they aren't changing the risk factor much. I remember reading about the current creators not liking the way monsters can 1 shot you with high damage currently but this method is effectively the same except you are 1 shotted because of low health. I hope there's more to it than that.
Consider that Blizzard is likely looking to cut down on the number of 30 second MF runs, and they don't necessarily want people getting easy heals by leaving the game, joining it again, then immediately porting to where their friends are because that would be tedious... wouldn't surprise me to see logout timers in the game strictly to serve as that sort of annoyance to try and keep people in games regardless of balance issues with HC.
It's a shame I keep hearing about Blizzard wanting to cut down on the things I liked about the Diablo series.
In my opinion the timer(from 30 seconds to 5 seconds...) would be a really bad thing for playing HC. First of all we have to admit that the instant S&E really wasn't that safe what most ppl think. There were cases where it was useful.
Running away from monsters, knowing you won't be able to kill them
Running into a dead end, realising the abilities of the monster, and exit before the fight
But there were like 50% chance to being fast enough to quit in the middle of a fight what you started. In Diablo 2 deads were fast and sometimes unnoticable. In Diablo 2 you knew that you can die in every second from a randomly generated monster what luckily got the abilities to 1-2 shot you. Not even poiton spamming saved you in those cases.
In Diablo 3 there won't be potion spamming, there won't be TPs, but there will be monsters. And with this new heling system it is easily imaginable that you stuck in a bunch of monsters without the ability to move while they eating your life and the orb 5 inches from you is not reachable.
I'm not really sure blizzard thinking about the Hardcore gameplay yet. And I'm not sure at all that dead won't be an essential part of the game like in WoW where you can not avoid that, especially in dungeons.
GoBigRed
13-12-2008, 10:36
In my opinion the timer(from 30 seconds to 5 seconds...) would be a really bad thing for playing HC. First of all we have to admit that the instant S&E really wasn't that safe what most ppl think. There were cases where it was useful.
Running away from monsters, knowing you won't be able to kill them
Running into a dead end, realising the abilities of the monster, and exit before the fight
But there were like 50% chance to being fast enough to quit in the middle of a fight what you started. In Diablo 2 deads were fast and sometimes unnoticable. In Diablo 2 you knew that you can die in every second from a randomly generated monster what luckily got the abilities to 1-2 shot you. Not even poiton spamming saved you in those cases.
In Diablo 3 there won't be potion spamming, there won't be TPs, but there will be monsters. And with this new heling system it is easily imaginable that you stuck in a bunch of monsters without the ability to move while they eating your life and the orb 5 inches from you is not reachable.
I'm not really sure blizzard thinking about the Hardcore gameplay yet. And I'm not sure at all that dead won't be an essential part of the game like in WoW where you can not avoid that, especially in dungeons.
Maybe blizzard is thinking about this and is actually going to try and make hardcore a difficult mode, from my experience, hardcore is really easy, especially once you start getting items, the only time d2 was really challenging was untwinked melee characters//unusual builds where you purposely made the game harder for yourself. Also, when I say challenging here, I mean time consuming because most classes were able to blow through levels very quickly.
Maybe blizzard is thinking about this and is actually going to try and make hardcore a difficult mode, from my experience, hardcore is really easy, especially once you start getting items, the only time d2 was really challenging was untwinked melee characters//unusual builds where you purposely made the game harder for yourself. Also, when I say challenging here, I mean time consuming because most classes were able to blow through levels very quickly.
I don't really see why you always come with the difficult thing. If you want you can try beating the game in only white items, wihtout spending any skill points and with your eyes closed... It is not the matter of how blizzard sets the toughness of the hardcore mode. In my opinion it isn't depends on the time what it takes you to logout. Hardcore mode is about One Life, and that what makes it hardcore. It is not about the toughness, it is about You Can't Make Mistakes. Not only one of them.
P.S.: Anyway I like D2CHC way more then D2LoDHC. CS run >>>>>>> Baal run
GoBigRed
14-12-2008, 03:21
I don't really see why you always come with the difficult thing. If you want you can try beating the game in only white items, wihtout spending any skill points and with your eyes closed... It is not the matter of how blizzard sets the toughness of the hardcore mode. In my opinion it isn't depends on the time what it takes you to logout. Hardcore mode is about One Life, and that what makes it hardcore. It is not about the toughness, it is about You Can't Make Mistakes. Not only one of them.
I go to difficulty of diablo 2 because it was a poorly balanced game in many ways, death in diablo2 itself was mostly due to lag/pkers(which are being eliminated in diablo3) and the occasional monster deaths were from the 1 hitters that you mentioned. From what I've gathered, they're trying to make it so a lvl 60-70 can't beat hell mode and that you might actually have to go through the ENTIRE game rather than skip 90% of it(most of the areas being completely worthless) while they force you to stay in combat rather than just save and exit or go to town 50000 times. The logout timer would be more to prevent the chicken hacks that were rampant and those 1 hit monsters you're talking about are being eliminated supposedly. We still have yet to see how frequent healing will be so it's hard to say how long or if a timer should be added, I know S&E saved me alot on d2 due to blindly teleporting through hell durance or a similar place trying to get the elite gear. A logout timer is just an easier way of balancing the game out, which combined with items not having str/dex reqs, autostats, and who knows what else, they'll be able to create a more balanced game. Imagine playing diablo2 hc without pkers or 1 hit monsters, think how many more people would still be alive...
Solstice
14-12-2008, 04:02
I'd say 5 seconds logout timer would be a good idea. That'd be just perfect in my opinion.
It would prevent spamming games.
Also, if there would be some button to cancel timer, that'd be even better.
So if you missed something, you could just cancel the timer to get whatever you missed.
Muzozavr
14-12-2008, 20:11
Why not just return to D1's "save everything" system -- AKA get rid of respawning enemies, and save the enemies still alive exactly where they are?
That will solve the problem with no need for artificial logout times, while still allowing social lives to happen.
Think about it. What happens if everything is saved EXACTLY the same and you try to save-and-exit?
That's right, when you load the game you're still in the same spot -- and since the enemies are also saved -- in the same danger. And when you die (on HC) the game calmly and swiftly erases your savefile. Problem solved.
Who knows, they may do that for SP. Doesn't work in MP though.
Cheeseflys
15-12-2008, 02:16
I don't think there should be a log out timer, as there's those few times were you really have to leave, and there's nothing you can do about it.
Specially now that TPs are gone, you can't just TP back to town, then log out without worry.
And, if you want a challenge do the SPF Tournys.
MoUsE_WiZ
15-12-2008, 07:03
I don't think there should be a log out timer, as there's those few times were you really have to leave, and there's nothing you can do about it.
Specially now that TPs are gone, you can't just TP back to town, then log out without worry.
And, if you want a challenge do the SPF Tournys.
If you want your challenge from SP the existence of a timer shouldn't bother you.
Muzozavr
15-12-2008, 08:41
How about these 5 seconds being not an artificial timer (which frustrates) but a simple fade-to-black when you lose control but enemies can still move?
MoUsE_WiZ
15-12-2008, 16:13
How about these 5 seconds being not an artificial timer (which frustrates) but a simple fade-to-black when you lose control but enemies can still move?
1) Because a timer can be cancelled should you change your mind about the safety of your current location
2) Because why bother fading to black in that case, why not just take you back to b.net immediately leaving your character in the game?
wow has 45sec non combat logout system and it worked quiet well. i dont mind it reduce to say 20sec.
Evidently a lot of you guys like this idea, but it sounds like another major change to the game that I loved enough to become hooked. I loved playing party games in situations where a real person could try to lay a smack down on me. I'm talking almost instant kills that I had to be ready for. I loved playing the game and being so ready to jump ship that I could do it VERY quickly. That was fun!
Now you're saying that the new game should be set up that I will never, ever be in a situation where my character will die in less than 15 or even 30 seconds... YAWN.. I might as well sleep through it!
Also, short MF games gone as a consequence of this and other game changes? YUCK!
D II was an action game. I guess the new game will be more of a strategy thing.. Not for me.. :wave:
Synchrotron
31-12-2008, 00:41
Timed logout for HC is good but don't dare to suggest that por SC. No way i'm going to wait 30 seconds everytime i want to stop playing the game.
CombatShrine
06-01-2009, 23:19
They could just make it so you are unable to town portal or s/e if your life is below some threshold value (e.g. you're too weak to cast the tp spell).
That way you have to be very careful of what trouble you land yourself in.
Ideally, the percentage should be high, to avoid a chicken hack that just triggered when you were about to breach the threshold.
Its somewhat hard to explain, but I'll try.
Characters suffer damage constantly throughout the game, but they can survive when the rate of healing available to them cancels (or beats) the rate damage is inflicted on them (that is, their health amount is in dynamic equilibrium). If you plotted a graph of damage received vs. time for a typical melee character, it would probably look like a noisy waveform. There would be large spikes in the graph whenever the character took on a particularly nasty monster. Fighting with normal monsters would produce the noise. The key to selecting what the threshold would be, is to place it slightly below the typical damage-noise level, so that you''re only locked out of S/E when you have truly been put in real danger (as should), and because damage is a discrete quantity, any type of chickenhack would be completely unable to tell whether an excursion close to the threshold value was simply normal equilibrium, or a flirtation with disaster. A character using chickenhack might still be able to save himself every now and then from real danger, but quite often he would find himself saving and exiting under situations he had perfect control.
This wouldn't nullify the chickenhack, but would make it something of a liability to use.
Just my idea anyways.
I don't understand why people obsess about whether someone else might cheat or not. I don't care about chickenhack. I'm as competitive as the next guy, but wow! :crazyeyes:
MoUsE_WiZ
10-01-2009, 01:00
I don't understand why people obsess about whether someone else might cheat or not. I don't care about chickenhack. I'm as competitive as the next guy, but wow! :crazyeyes:
Because it ruins the economy to have more high levels than there should be?
Because it'd be nice to actually be able to "kill" people in duel games from time to time?
Plenty of reasons, those are the first two that come to mind.
BitsNPieces
11-01-2009, 19:33
Hmm saving and exiting just aint the #1 "skill" for me. I prefer to equip a lot of FRW so I can retreat and fight on. But a little while back I was playing a twinked baba in normal dif so I didn't care about getting surrounded. Then I couldn't hit anything anymore. My guy was swinging like a mad man (surrounded by Shenk's pack) but I didn't land a single hit. The game didn't freeze but quite certain it was lag bc ALL monsters visible were allowed by the server to hit me as I could see from the "attacker takes damage" animations everywhere. As I drank potions I realized the only way out was a quick save and exit. And yes, if there had been a timer it would have been a death in normal dif :)
Silverkill
13-01-2009, 12:53
I think 5-10 seconds will be more than enough for a person that want leave (S&Q) difficult obstacles to die. At the same time if you just need to leave game it is not a long period, so u can w8 till ur char is off...
satheron
13-01-2009, 19:59
After a tough battle, that I won, I decide to logout to call it a day.
/me pushes the exit button.
30...
29..
28..
More monsters come.
Now lets say I wanted to log off because my children or wife were calling me? yet I was in a position outside of combat to begin with when I wanted to log off?
A decent idea in theory, and your example with neo in a a phonebooth is true..but its also not true that for every taxi/bus/car/plane I board I count to 30 each time before getting on.
You know what would keep me from getting on the following forms of transportation? A fight.
A much better idea is that you should only be allowed to exit outside of combat, just like it most other games out today.
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